Waveridr85 once wrote:
I recall it being written that NX is better because they claim all their numbers to be guaranteed to be accurate.
Here is the question. Why would a kit be so different? all it involves is a bottle(which won't make much of a difference unless you are using a super shot, solenoids(which are just either opened or closed) fuel tees, and lines. The only possible influence in hp that would be reasonable for me to understand would be from the jets to the nozzle.
Is there really that much of a difference in nozzles? If so, i am using a cold fusion nozzle and am wondering if i should upgrade it.
Jime responded:
You are pretty much correct in your assumptions.
However up until a few months ago NX was the only wet kit on the street and that is where I believe their strength lies. That is the only kit they produce, they do not make a dry kit like the others.
Now Zex, NOS and ??? have started to produce a wet kit as well, likely because of the popularity that NX was gaining and they wanted the market share back.
Now I don't know how good the Zex or NOS wet kits are because I really haven't seen any reviews or know of anyone who has installed one and reported back.
Is their really that much of a difference in nozzles?? I believe so because that was why NOS failed in their previous attempts at having a workable wet system for a dry manifold design engine.
Also the reason NX can claim accuracy is that with the wet kit you are putting in exactly the same amount of fuel/nitrous mixture every time through one nozzle (2 jets fuel and nitrous) and that amount of HP is fairly easily calculated.
With a dry kit the nitrous is a given but the additional fuel, because it is put through the injectors as a result of higher fuel pressure is not always the same because of varying fuel pressures between engines using the same size fuel jet. Some of our engines take vastly difference jets to achieve the same fuel pressure and many times people who are just using the stock jets, just insert them and pray that fuel pressure is going to be ok without even having a gauge.
Which is the best? Well I did have a dry NOS kit before the NX and there was a dramatic change in my 1/4 mile at that time, 13.8 vs 13.1 in my 97 SE with no other changes. Will the Zex and NOS WET kits produce the same results? Probably, I don't see why they shouldn't. I do like the NX because of their high quality, larger and stronger solenoids that are guaranteed for life, but then they sponsor me and I say good things about sponsors. They also have excellent support and will rebuild your solenoids every year, if you want to for free, you just pay the postage and thats hard to beat.
Waveridr85 responded:
Do you mind posting a pciture of your nozzle? I am running a kit made by coldfusion. Many people have said they are the cmpany that either provides parts for nx or makes some of their parts. If you look at the website (coldfusionnitrous.com) you will see the solenoids looks almost identical. As for the nozzzle, I am unsure.
The reason why I bought the kit was it was 500 shipped for a wet kit, 15 lb bottle, and purge. All new. The only thing I need to buy was switches and wires.
As for the zex, I do beleive there is a downfall in their setup because it becomes difficult to upgrade due to both solenoids being held in one box.
The waveridr85 added:
I did some further research looking into the horsepower claims of NOS, ZEX, and NX. Here are my results:
I have found that for the 100 hp claim that all companies use all companies provide different jet sizes. Therefore all 100 shots cannot be compared at all.
N20 Jet Fuel Jet N20 Jet/Fuel Jet Diameter Ratios
NOS .047 .038 123.684/100
NX .052 .031 113.043/100
ZEX .046 .030 153.333/100
Figures were achieved by using (NX). 052/. 031 = X/100
If optimal bottle pressure would be at 900 PSI, and fuel would be at 44 PSI. The following figures would a close approximate of fuel to n20 mixtures.
NOS 42.3/1.672
NX 46.8/1.364
ZEX 41.4/1.320
These figures were achieved by the following method:
JET SIZE x BOTTLE PRESURE / JET SIZE x FUEL PRESURE
To show the exact nitrous point per fuel point, I came up with these figures:
NOS 25.29904/1
NX 34.31085/1
ZEX 31.36363/1
These were achieved by
JET SIZE x BOTTLE PRESURE / JET SIZE x FUEL PRESURE = X/1
Well as we can see, the richest fuel setup would be NOS. This would allow for the safest conditions by avoiding running too lean and causing heat to break or fry engine components
The leanest system would be NX. It came in with a %20 leaner mixtures than Zex. This, in my opinion would result in the least safe of the nitrous systems.
The base nitrous jets also varied between companies. The reason why NX kits make more horsepower is because they use a higher jet for the 100hp claim. Their jet is a .052 as opposed to the Zex .046 Nitrous jet. With a %13 percent higher nitrous jet over Zex, and a %10.3 higher jet than NOS, it can be very well expected they make higher horsepower figures due to the higher amount of nitrous be injected.
All in all, the only thing that sets these kits apart that matters would be the flow rate of the solenoids (which would not affect horsepower unless shooting an extremely high shot) like the solenoids the bottle valve, which also would not affect power unless an extremely high shot is being used, the jets, and the nozzles. Since the jet sizes would vary from company to company the only way to test which company makes the best horsepower would be to use the same jets on all products and to test them.
Due to jet differences varying between companies, it is unfair to say who makes more horsepower, since different companies use different amount of Nitrous. The only conclusions that can be made, with the stock jet sizes, is that Zex is the safest kit running the most rich setup, and NX is the leanest.
******These numbers can be wrong since I am not %100 sure of my findings. I encourage anyone to correct any mistakes on my behalf. *******
I will hopefully do a dyno-test comparing the different nozzles with the same jets.
Jime responded:
I do applaud your research and your number crunching and believe me I am not trying to jump on you in any way.
However, you can throw out the NOS jets because they are dry kit jets and the fuel jets are totally invalid because they are used to increase fuel pressure not flow fuel like the Zex and NX fuel jets are.
Also you will not find a nitrous company that will recommend jets that do not fall in safe A/F territory. I know for a fact that the NX jets are in the 11.0-11.5 A/F area and on the safe side. NX also guarantees their HP output to be within 2% of their ratings WHP not crank so you cannot just compare jet sizes to come up with a magic number.
Zex controls their A/F based on the bottle pressure so jet sizes are irrelevant with their systems and NX recommends a bottle pressure of 1050 as opposed to 900-950 for other companies so its very hard to relate anything with just jet sizes.
I wish it was that easy but there are so many variables.
Even the fact that the fuel pressure between 4th and 5th Gen Maximas are 10 psi apart (ie 43 vs 52) make a difference in the jet sizes. That is why there are so many charts for different cars. That is why I encourage folks to call the company to get the latest chart sizes recommended.
Waveridr85 added:
Thanks for your input, like I said, it was only an assumption and giving an idea that we could more thouroghly work out.
As for the NOS jets, I thought they had came out with a wet system? If not correct me if I am wrong. Please explain how they regulate presure as well.
Jime added:
Those jet sizes are exactly the same as the chart I posted which are for the dry setup. I wasn't able to obtain the wet jet chart.
In the dry setup the fuel jets are tee'd into the vacuum line to the fuel pressure regulator vs in the dry the fuel actually is fed through the jets.
The dry system bumps up the fuel pressure so that the extra fuel necessary for the nitrous is fed through the injectors vs through the intake in the wet setup.
Nitrous is actually fed to the top of the fuel pressure regulator in a dry setup which holds the regulator down causing less fuel through the return line and more pressure in the fuel feed line. The jet in the dry system actually bleeds nitrous (not fuel) pressure away from the regulator so that the larger the jet the more pressure is bled off and the lower the fuel pressure is.
Here is the chart I posted and as I said the fuel jets are for a DRY system and should not be used for a wet setup.
I should have specified in this chart that the NOS jetting is for dry sytems. I did specify that the Zex was wet and of course NX only makes wet.
Here are some interesting calcs:
Using your same numbers for a 100 shot, ie NOS 47, NX 52, Zex 46 and using the fuel pressure of 44 and nitrous pressure of 900 the calculator below shows the following:
1. NOS 84.8 to the wheels on a 26 fuel jet.
2. NX 103.8 to the wheels on a 29 fuel jet.
3. Zex 81.2 to the wheels on a 25 fuel jet.
Both NX and Zex suggest larger fuel jets, NX by 2 and Zex by 5 from the calculator, so as I suggested to earlier they will err on the side of caution. The numbers for NOS I can't compare the fuel because I don't have their recommended wet sizes for a 100 shot but the nitrous jet should remain constant.
http://www.robietherobot.com/NitrousJetCalculator.htm
Waveridr85:
hanks for posting that Jime, It looks as if the nitrous jet for Nx(compared to Zex), being %13 higher and the %16 bigger fuel jet, produces %27 more horsepower. It looks as if you can just add the percentage increase (13+16=29) and get an approximate figure of how much % horsepower is going to be created.